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The M1870 Italian Vetterli Rifle

Sorry Guys but this is one of the Ugliest Rifles that I have ever seen! Which is really surprising to me. As The Italians almost always led the way in Style. Go figure!Italian Vetterli Carcano Model 1870/87/16, Non-Import, Blue 33 1/2” - Military Bolt Action Rifle MFD 1887 Antique No FFL - Picture 5

Italian Vetterli Carcano Model 1870/87/16, Non-Import, Blue 33 1/2” - Military Bolt Action Rifle MFD 1887 Antique No FFL - Picture 7
Italian Vetterli Carcano Model 1870/87/16, Non-Import, Blue 33 1/2” - Military Bolt Action Rifle MFD 1887 Antique No FFL - Picture 8
Italian Vetterli Carcano Model 1870/87/16, Non-Import, Blue 33 1/2” - Military Bolt Action Rifle MFD 1887 Antique No FFL - Picture 9
Here below is some more information about this critter!

 

Vetterli Model 1870
Vetterli-Vitali.jpg

Vetterli-Vitali rifle M1870/87
Type Bolt-action rifle
Place of origin  Kingdom of Italy
Service history
In service 1870-1941 (at least)
Used by Kingdom of Italy
Wars First Italo-Ethiopian War
Boxer Rebellion
World War I
Second Italo-Ethiopian War
Spanish Civil War
Production history
Variants M1870/87 and M1870/87/15
Specifications
Weight M1870/87: 10.19 lb (4.62 kg)
M1870/87/15: 10.19 lb (4.62 kg)
Length 52.95 in (134.5 cm)
Barrel length 33.85 in (86.0 cm)

Cartridge M1870/87: 10.4×47mmR
M1870/87/15: 6.5×52mm Carcano
Action Bolt-action
Muzzle velocity M1870/87: 1,410 ft/s (430 m/s)
M1870/87/15: 2,395 ft/s (730 m/s)
Effective firing range M1870/87: 2,000 m (2,200 yd)
M1870/87/15: 2,000 m (2,200 yd)
Feed system M1870: single shot
M1870/87: 4 round magazine
M1870/87/15: 6 round magazine

The M1870 Vetterli was the Italian service rifle from 1870-1887, when it was gradually replaced with the M1870/87 Italian Vetterli-Vitali variant. The M1870 was a single-shot bolt action rifle chambered for the 10.4mm Vetterli centrefire cartridge, at first loaded with black powder and later with smokeless powder. The M1870 was based upon the M1869 Swiss Vetterli but simplified for economy.

M1870/87[edit]

  • 10.4mm Fucile di Fanteria, Modello 1870/87 Vetterli-Vitali

In 1887 (until 1896), the Italian Army began converting the M1870 to a four-shot repeating rifle, based on the system designed by Italian artillery captain, G. Vitali. This conversion added a box magazine fed from a Swiss-style fabricated steel and wood stripper clip holding four cartridges, in the same caliber (10.4x47R mm) as before. The clip is pressed into the magazine, until the last round catches under the Cartridge retainer, and then the clip is withdrawn using the “pull string” in the top wooden frame of the clip. Clips of cartridges were supplied in a soldered sheet steel box, holding six clips.
The conversion to the Vitali magazine was done on the long rifle, the TS (special troops musketoon) and possibly some of the Carabinieri carbines; No Vitali conversions were done to the Moschetto da Cavalleria for metropolitan Italian troops. In 1888, the Fondo Coloniale (Eritrea) requested 500 Vitali-converted Vetterli cavalry carbines for the Eritrean Native Cavalry (“spahi“—Swahili for “horse-soldier”). There are currently five known examples still in existence ( one in Australia, two in the US, two in Italy). Collectors refer to it as the M1870/88 V.V.Eritrean cav carbine. The Regio Esercito (Royal Army) Cavalry units maintained the M1870 single shot Moschetto da cavalleria until replaced by the M1891 Moschetto da cavalleria, in 1893.
The conversion is indicted by a cartouche “Artig. Fab. D’armi Terni 1888” (dates vary), on the butt stock. The center of the cartouche displays a Crest of Savoy and the word, Riparazione (Italian for repair) is directly below the cartouche. Shortages of small arms appeared from the very beginning of Italy’s entrance into World War I on the side of the Allies.
As more of the population mobilized for the first total war in European history, the supply of modern small arms fell short before the end of 1915 and a large number of obsolete Modello 1870/87 Vetterli-Vital were issued to newly formed regiments that were not expected to be in combat, however, troops carried these antiquated rifles into battle on several occasions.
As well, in 1916, Italy sent a large number of Vetterli-Vitali rifles to Russia; ammunition and components were contracted for by Britain to the Remington Armory. These “tsarist” rifles eventually ended up in Republican hands in the Spanish Civil War, as the Soviet Union emptied its depots of all the old black powder and early smokeless rifles it had inherited after the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917.

M1870/87/15[edit]

During World War I, many M1870/87 rifles were converted to share the same 6.5mm smokeless powder round as the primary service rifle, the Carcano, by adding a 6.5mm barrel lining and a modified M91 Carcano magazine. The barrel sleeving was called the “Salerno method”; The bolt face was also machined to accept the smaller diameter 6.5 mm cartridge head, and the firing pin shortened. These conversions were used for rear echelon troops (guards, training, etc.) and were rarely, if at all, fired with standard 6.5 mm military ball ammunition. After WWI, many of these rifles were assigned to the colonies of Tripolitania, Fezzan and Cyrenaica (Libya) and also to Eritrea and Somalia, again, as rarely-fired training rifles. These rifles were used again in the Second Italo-Ethiopian War, mostly by native African soldiers.[1]
It is considered by knowledgeable collectors[who?] that due to the rifle’s age and general condition (manufactured in 1870-1890s) and converted twice (1887-90s and again 1915-16), that the black powder technology of the Vetterli design is not suitable for repeated use (i.e. intense combat use) with normal Italian ball ammunition of 6.5 mm, or its present-day commercial equivalent. Even back in the 1920s, anecdotal accounts of Salerno sleeves loosening under “hot” fire (they were soft-soldered in place) and subsequent “blow-by” experience since the 1950s appearance of these rifles as surplus has led to safety concerns.[2]

Comparison with contemporary rifles[edit]

Comparison of 1880s rifles[3]
Calibre System Country Velocity Height of trajectory Ammunition
Muzzle 500 yd (460 m) 1,000 yd (910 m) 1,500 yd (1,400 m) 2,000 yd (1,800 m) 500 yd (460 m) 1,000 yd (910 m) 1,500 yd (1,400 m) 2,000 yd (1,800 m) Propellant Bullet
.433 in (11.0 mm) Werndl–Holub rifle Austria-Hungary 1,439 ft/s (439 m/s) 854 ft/s (260 m/s) 620 ft/s (190 m/s) 449 ft/s (137 m/s) 328 ft/s (100 m/s) 8.252 ft (2.515 m) 49.41 ft (15.06 m) 162.6 ft (49.6 m) 426.0 ft (129.8 m) 77 gr (5.0 g) 370 gr (24 g)
.45 in (11.43 mm) Martini–Henry United Kingdom 1,315 ft/s (401 m/s) 869 ft/s (265 m/s) 664 ft/s (202 m/s) 508 ft/s (155 m/s) 389 ft/s (119 m/s) 9.594 ft (2.924 m) 47.90 ft (14.60 m) 147.1 ft (44.8 m) 357.85 ft (109.07 m) 85 gr (5.5 g) 480 gr (31 g)
.433 in (11.0 mm) Fusil Gras mle 1874 France 1,489 ft/s (454 m/s) 878 ft/s (268 m/s) 643 ft/s (196 m/s) 471 ft/s (144 m/s) 348 ft/s (106 m/s) 7.769 ft (2.368 m) 46.6 ft (14.2 m) 151.8 ft (46.3 m) 389.9 ft (118.8 m) 80 gr (5.2 g) 386 gr (25.0 g)
.433 in (11.0 mm) Mauser Model 1871 Germany 1,430 ft/s (440 m/s) 859 ft/s (262 m/s) 629 ft/s (192 m/s) 459 ft/s (140 m/s) 388 ft/s (118 m/s) 8.249 ft (2.514 m) 48.68 ft (14.84 m) 159.2 ft (48.5 m) 411.1 ft (125.3 m) 75 gr (4.9 g) 380 gr (25 g)
.408 in (10.4 mm) M1870 Italian Vetterli Italy 1,430 ft/s (440 m/s) 835 ft/s (255 m/s) 595 ft/s (181 m/s) 422 ft/s (129 m/s) 304 ft/s (93 m/s) 8.527 ft (2.599 m) 52.17 ft (15.90 m) 176.3 ft (53.7 m) 469.9 ft (143.2 m) 62 gr (4.0 g) 310 gr (20 g)
.397 in (10.08 mm) Jarmann M1884 Norway and Sweden 1,536 ft/s (468 m/s) 908 ft/s (277 m/s) 675 ft/s (206 m/s) 504 ft/s (154 m/s) 377 ft/s (115 m/s) 7.235 ft (2.205 m) 42.97 ft (13.10 m) 137.6 ft (41.9 m) 348.5 ft (106.2 m) 77 gr (5.0 g) 337 gr (21.8 g)
.42 in (10.67 mm) Berdan rifle Russia 1,444 ft/s (440 m/s) 873 ft/s (266 m/s) 645 ft/s (197 m/s) 476 ft/s (145 m/s) 353 ft/s (108 m/s) 7.995 ft (2.437 m) 47.01 ft (14.33 m) 151.7 ft (46.2 m) 388.7 ft (118.5 m) 77 gr (5.0 g) 370 gr (24 g)
.45 in (11.43 mm) Springfield model 1884 United States 1,301 ft/s (397 m/s) 875 ft/s (267 m/s) 676 ft/s (206 m/s) 523 ft/s (159 m/s) 404 ft/s (123 m/s) 8.574 ft (2.613 m) 46.88 ft (14.29 m) 142.3 ft (43.4 m) 343.0 ft (104.5 m) 70 gr (4.5 g) 500 gr (32 g)
.40 in (10.16 mm) Enfield-Martini United Kingdom 1,570 ft/s (480 m/s) 947 ft/s (289 m/s) 719 ft/s (219 m/s) 553 ft/s (169 m/s) 424 ft/s (129 m/s) 6.704 ft (2.043 m) 39.00 ft (11.89 m) 122.0 ft (37.2 m) 298.47 ft (90.97 m) 85 gr (5.5 g) 384 gr (24.9 g)

Gallery[edit]

Sources[edit]

For the specifications and the service history of the Italian Vetterli-Vitali rifles. M1870/87 and the M1870/87/15: http://milpas.cc/rifles/ZFiles/Italian%20Rifles/The%20ITALIAN%20VETTERLI-VITALI%20RIFLES/VETTERLI-VITALI%20M1870%20MOSCHETTO%20CAVALRY%20CARBINE.wps.htm#MODEL_18708715_RIFLEen:First Italo-Ethiopian WarBattaglia_dell’Amba_Alagi (it)Battaglia_di_Adua (it)Vetterli-Vitali_Mod._1870/87 (it)Vetterli-Vitali_Mod._1870/87/15 (it)http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=156589 Italian forces in the Boxer Rebellion.
For amendments and additions (July 2, 2015) Typographical, Vitali clip design and function, Eritrean Cav.Carbine, Salerno method, Safety of Ball 6,5 ammunition: Personal examination and research by Dr. Astrid M.Vallati MD, JD. (DocAV) AV Ballistics Technical and Forensic Services, Brisbane, Australia. Rifles examined: M1870/87 Long Rifle, ex-Tsarist Russia, ex SCW; Moschetto TS M1870/87 AOI marked; Moschetto Cavalleria Eritrea M1870/88: Provenance Confirmed, Bringback to Australia, in 1928, by Surveyor-Gen. of Sudan; Acquired from grandson of same in 1990s, with Certificate of Sudan Service. Fucile M70/87/15 Cal. 6,5mm.

References[edit]

  1. Jump up^ http://candrsenal.com/rifle-italian-vetterli-carcano-m708715/ C&Rsenal
  2. Jump up^ https://gunsmagazine.com/emergency-stopgap/ Guns Magazine
  3. Jump up^ “The New Martini-Enfield Rifle” (PDF). The Engineer. 2 July 1886. p. 16. Retrieved 3 April 2017 – via Grace’s Guide to British Industrial History.

 

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A Victory!

Some Good News & out of New York of all Places, HUZZAH!!!

Five-judge panel finds disgraced former AG Eric Schneiderman failed to demonstrate authority to prosecute the state’s first ever SAFE Act case

April 26, 2019 | BUFFALO, N.Y. – The New York State Supreme Court, Appellate Division, Fourth Department issued a crushing rebuke today to Albany’s far-left progressives seeking to legislate Second Amendment civil rights out of existence via imperial gun control edicts like the SAFE Act. In a unanimous decision, the State Supreme Court ruled that the New York State Attorney General’s Office, headed by the disgraced Eric Schneiderman at the time of initial legal action, failed to demonstrate legal authority to prosecute the SAFE Act violations originally levelled against Defendant-Appellant Benjamin Wassell.
In today’s decision, the Court stated:
“Here, the stipulated record on appeal does not establish that the Superintendent of State Police requested that the Attorney General prosecute this case. Indeed, there is no letter from the Superintendent in the record (see id. at 134; cf. Rogers, 157 AD3d at 1002; Marketing & Adv. Servs. Ctr. Corp., 272 AD2d at 982), nor is there any other showing in the record that a request came from the Superintendent himself. Because the People failed to establish that the Attorney General had authority to secure the indictment and prosecute the case, we conclude that the judgment must be reversed and the indictment dismissed (see Gilmour, 98 NY2d at 135).”
The result of the Court’s decision is that Wassell’s indictment “is dismissed and the matter is remitted to Chautauqua County Court for proceedings pursuant to CPL 470.45.”

HELP FIGHT EMPEROR CUOMO IN THE SUPREME COURT

“The simple truth is that Second Amendment civil rights won today, and the agenda of unconstitutional gun control force-fed to Upstate New York by the progressive totalitarians occupying the imperial palace in Albany lost,” 2AWNY.COM Civil Rights Advocate Steve Felano said. “Attorney Jim Ostrowski, the mastermind behind Ben Wassell’s appeal, correctly pointed out to the Court that the New York State Attorney General failed miserably to demonstrate the legal authority required to prosecute Ben Wassell for SAFE Act violations, which are, themselves, unconstitutional in the first place. The Court agreed with Jim because his argument was spot-on and logically unassailable. Furthermore, disgraced former Attorney General Eric Schneiderman, likely because he wanted to insert himself into the first ever SAFE Act case for political gain, committed a massive error in failing to demonstrate the authority of his office to prosecute the Wassell case. As the AG’s office retreats to Albany to lick the wounds inflicted by this crushing defeat, its occupants should note 2AWNY is not giving up the fight to repeal the SAFE Act in total, and the assault against Albany’s imperial gun control regime will continue. Andrew Cuomo should likewise take notice.”
Because the New York State Supreme Court dismissed Wassell’s indictment due to a lack of prosecutorial authority, the judges who decided the case “do not address defendant’s remaining contentions.” Said remaining contentions, articulated in Jim Ostrowski’s prior brief to the Court, center on the unconstitutional nature of the SAFE Act. Ostrowski clearly, logically, and forcefully demonstrated that the SAFE Act should be nullified in total based on the following:

  • Unconstitutional
  • Void for vagueness
  • Due process violation
  • Lack of equal protection under the law

The above assertions regarding the SAFE Act are supported by a growing body of contemporary Second Amendment jurisprudence that has expanded in scope and prominence as recently as March 29, 2019. This is, of course, the date that the U.S. District Court for the Southern District of California decided Duncan v. Becerra. As a result of this case, U.S. District Judge Roger T. Benitez ruled that California’s draconian regulations and bans on firearms magazines accepting more than 10 rounds is unconstitutional under the Second and Fourteenth Amendments of the United States Constitution. A similar fate, supported by the latest academic research from Boston University and Harvard researchers indicating that ‘assault weapons’ and magazine bans do not lower homicide rates, awaits the New York State SAFE Act. 2AWNY will not rest until that fate is secured.
To learn more about any of the above, please contact Steve Felano at (518) 852-1863 or sfelano@2AWNY.com.

HELP FIGHT EMPEROR CUOMO IN THE SUPREME COURT

– 30 –
2AWNY is a force multiplier for the numerous Second Amendment civil rights advocacy enterprises forming the backbone of Western New York’s vibrant gun culture. We act as a 2A news and information distribution, policy analysis, and organizational driver for the many interest groups seeking to defend and expand Second Amendment civil rights throughout the region. 2AWNY is dedicated to assisting in the organization, promotion, and funding of legal challenges to the unconstitutional New York State gun control regime. We seek to make Western New York the epicenter of New York State’s Second Amendment civil rights renaissance. Learn more at WWW.2AWNY.COM.